Today’s leaders face extraordinary challenges. This is particularly true in work environments that focus on the public good. So what keeps these leaders going?
Every few weeks, I’ll share an episode of my new podcast, MESSY, where I talk to leaders in higher education, healthcare, non-profit and other complex environments about their lived experiences and make sense of their leadership journeys. Join me and listen to the conversations on Apple or Spotify, or stream the latest episode below.
Episode 9
Guest: Dr. Lynn Wells, President and Vice-Chancellor, Laurentian University
Changing the narrative – regreening a community
Leading through renewal and reinvention.
What does it take to lead after an institutional trauma without making it about you?
Dr. Lynn Wells, President and Vice-Chancellor of Laurentian University, traces a steady path from crisis to renewal: changing a damaging narrative, rebuilding trust, and putting “student-first” at the centre of every hard call.
Drawing on her earlier chapters at other institutions, from reconciliation work at First Nations University of Canada to student-centred leadership at MacEwan and pandemic decision-making at Brock — Lynn shows how process, patience, and humility become anchors when the ground keeps shifting.
Lynn is candid about the human work beneath the headlines: helping a community heal, rejecting doom language, and choosing to lead alongside rather than from the front. She unpacks Laurentian’s tricultural identity, the deep bond with the city of Sudbury, and a powerful metaphor for recovery is the city’s decades-long “regreening,” a science-led restoration that mirrors the university’s rebuild.
Along the way Lynn addresses why good governance beats quick fixes, how to keep purpose intact under political and financial pressure, and the disciplines that keep leaders steady: clear boundaries, exercise, and grace for human fallibility.
Episode 8
Guest: Daniel Sharaiha, Chief Human Resources Officer and Customer Experience, Bank-al-Etihad
A foot in two different worlds | Balancing heart and mind
What does it mean to lead when your head and heart pull in different directions?
Daniel Sharaiha, a senior bank executive and humanitarian based in Jordan, has spent his career moving between the corporate and NGO worlds, finding clarity in the tension between them. From welcoming millions of refugees in a water-scarce country to championing women’s participation in the workforce, he shares how empathy, humour, and hope shape his approach to leadership.
In this candid conversation, Daniel reframes empathy as a strategic advantage, explores why influence and trust are a leader’s most valuable currency, and reflects on how humour and improvisation help him navigate complexity.
A grounded and inspiring look at what it means to bridge head and heart, profit and purpose, and to lead with curiosity, courage, and compassion.
Check out Daniel Sharaiha's convocation speech at HEC Paris.
Episode 7
Guest: Dr. Diana Beech, Director of Finsbury Institute, Professor and Assistant Vice-President of Policy and Government Affairs, City St George’s, University of London
Lead with purpose, not position
What does it mean to lead with purpose in complex systems shaped by politics, policy, and change?
In this reflective conversation, Dr Diana Beech, inaugural Director of the Finsbury Institute at City St George’s, University of London, traces her unconventional path across academia, government, and policy to reveal how curiosity, courage, and moral purpose define leadership. She shares lessons from failure and resilience, and the challenge of building something new from the ground up.
A grounded exploration of what it means to lead with purpose, not position — and to find opportunity and meaning in the mess of higher education and public life.
Episode 6
Guest: Dr. Benoit-Antoine Bacon, President and Vice-Chancellor, University of British Columbia
Leading through healing
What does it really mean to lead with authenticity? And how does healing your own wounds shape the way you show up as a leader?
Dr. Benoit-Antoine Bacon, President and Vice-Chancellor of the University of British Columbia, shares his extraordinary journey—from a difficult childhood and years of substance use to recovery, self-awareness, and purpose-driven leadership. He speaks candidly about fear, shame, and the inner work required to lead with compassion and love.
A powerful reflection on courage, vulnerability, and the lifelong work of becoming whole—both as a person and as a leader.
Episode 5
Guest: Dr. Tim McTiernan, President Emeritus, Ontario Tech University
Tap into an outsider mindset
What can being an outsider teach you about leadership?
Irish-Canadian leader Tim McTiernan shares how growing up between two worlds shaped his approach to collaboration, negotiation, and change across governments and universities. His story is a masterclass in listening, learning before acting, and finding clarity in complexity.
Episode 4
Guest: Sheldon Levy, President Emeritus, Ryerson University (TMU)
No risk, no reward - innovators needed
What does it take to truly innovate in higher education?
Sheldon Levy—one of Canada’s most recognisable post-secondary leaders—shares how bold thinking, risk-taking, and trusting students can transform institutions. From creating the DMZ at Ryerson (now TMU) to challenging universities and governments to embrace experimentation, Sheldon calls for leaders who break rules thoughtfully and align education with society’s needs.
A candid conversation on courage, change, and what it really means to lead innovation in complex systems.
Episode 3
Guest: Dr. Julia Christensen Hughes, President and Vice Chancellor, Yorkville University
Powered by passion and purpose
What happens when leadership and learning are truly aligned?
Dr. Julia Christensen Hughes reflects on her journey through higher education—from early disappointments as a student to leading change at the University of Guelph and Yorkville University. She shares how purpose, ethical leadership, and storytelling can drive transformation, even in systems resistant to change.
A thoughtful exploration of what it means to lead with conviction, measure impact through values, and reimagine universities as learning organisations.
Episode 2
Guest: Vivek Goel, President and Vice-Chancellor, University of Waterloo
The doctor will see you now | Leadership and AI
What does it take to lead with both science and soul?
Dr. Vivek Goel, President and Vice-Chancellor of the University of Waterloo, shares how his background in medicine and public health shaped a leadership philosophy grounded in evidence, empathy, and long-term vision. He reflects on his bold “Waterloo at 100” plan—reimagining the university’s next century—and explores how AI can transform learning, research, and human connection.
A timely look at leadership, foresight, and the future of education in an age defined by technology and change.
Episode 1
Welcome to Messy | Making sense of leadership
Ever wonder if leaders really matter in complex organizations?
I’m Daniel Atlin, an executive coach with over 30 years steering Canada’s universities, co-ops, and government sectors. In Messy, I dive into the chaotic world of purpose-driven leadership—think higher education, healthcare, and NGOs. Join me as I talk with global leaders about navigating stakeholder conflicts, geopolitical shifts, and crises, all while balancing influence over authority. It’s raw, it’s real, and it’s not for the faint of heart.